BRZ or used Porsche or ??? to replace S2000 for daily/track?

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DanB
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BRZ or used Porsche or ??? to replace S2000 for daily/track?

Post by DanB » Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:43 am

Daily-driver and sometime track S2000 is getting on in years and miles (over 250k!), thinking about a replacement.
Requirements: rwd, relatively lightweight, fixed roof preferred, somewhat reliable as a daily and backup track car.

BRZ is the only new car on the radar. Relatively lightweight at ~2750 lb. Only 205hp though (so jaded...), and F/R weight distribution is an unimpressive 54/46 and adding power would only make that worse...

Also considering 2wd Porsche 911 (996, maybe 997.1) or 987 Cayman. But what with IMS, cylinder scoring, D-chunk and a host of other potential issues, might not be worth the risk...

Let me know what experiences y'all have had with these as street/track cars. Or if there are other cars I should be considering.

Thanks!
'17 Subaru BRZ PP, #7 T60
Gone but not forgotten: Datsun 240Z, #7 SPB :cry:

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Re: BRZ or used Porsche or ??? to replace S2000 for daily/track?

Post by cfossum » Tue Nov 21, 2017 11:39 am

manual only?

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Re: BRZ or used Porsche or ??? to replace S2000 for daily/track?

Post by DanB » Tue Nov 21, 2017 12:14 pm

cfossum wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 11:39 am
manual only?
Yes. If there's a very good (in stop/go on the street as well as at the track) dual-clutch automated manual out there for reasonable $$$ I'd be willing to give it a try.
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Gone but not forgotten: Datsun 240Z, #7 SPB :cry:

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Re: BRZ or used Porsche or ??? to replace S2000 for daily/track?

Post by cfossum » Tue Nov 21, 2017 7:02 pm

Miata Hard Top RF
Any sporting sedan from BMW.
ATS 2.0 6-speed rwd
Lexus IS350 (65/35 LOL)

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Re: BRZ or used Porsche or ??? to replace S2000 for daily/track?

Post by djsteviec » Wed Nov 22, 2017 12:09 am

Interested in

997 koni challenge/ grand
$39
Redding, CT
Selling this 997 koni challenge/ grand AM GS race car.
Built and raced by BGB.
Asking 39k.

Someone I race with in AER.
https://scontent.fbed1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/ ... e=5AAA0A63

https://www.facebook.com/mstach
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Re: BRZ or used Porsche or ??? to replace S2000 for daily/track?

Post by breakaway500 » Wed Nov 22, 2017 12:54 pm

The BRZ/FRS cars I have been in (instructing) and driven have impressed me. The specification numbers may not scream performance (horsepower and weight bias) but on track they are extremely lively and their owners are very passionate about them and report no issues. Decent interiors and good seats. Brakes seem more than adequate. They are very affordable as well. Not much really in their price range/performance window other than a Miata from what I've encountered.
It's not what you drive, it's how you drive. "Lap times matter"

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Re: BRZ or used Porsche or ??? to replace S2000 for daily/track?

Post by DanB » Wed Nov 22, 2017 3:08 pm

cfossum wrote:
Tue Nov 21, 2017 7:02 pm
Miata Hard Top RF
Not fixed-roof! Also it would be nice to have a bit more utility vs. S2000 rather than the same or less...
Any sporting sedan from BMW.
ATS 2.0 6-speed rwd
Lexus IS350 (65/35 LOL)
Want something smaller/lighter!
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Gone but not forgotten: Datsun 240Z, #7 SPB :cry:

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Re: BRZ or used Porsche or ??? to replace S2000 for daily/track?

Post by paultg » Wed Nov 22, 2017 3:47 pm

I think the BRZ/FRS is your best option; although when I looked at them I felt the trunk/rear seat was so usless that I might as well have a MX5 convertible. Also the 2006-2014 NC generation cars go for about 1/2 of what a BRZ/FRS costs with similar mileage (at least the older ones do).

But I do wish I could fit a beach chair in my MX5 sometimes..
Only other option for you is a used 370Z, but they aren't really smaller or lighter.
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Re: BRZ or used Porsche or ??? to replace S2000 for daily/track?

Post by eb721 » Thu Nov 23, 2017 10:46 pm

I have a FRS and a NC Miata and I think the FRS has a good bit more interior space. Especially when you fold down the rear seats you end up extending your trunk space a lot. The front is a lot more spacious too which can be nice for a daily driver, but I do prefer the small feel of the Miata for the track. I think if you are looking at the same year and mileage Miata the prices are similar, but obviously they haven't been around long enough to get an older low mileage one which would go for a lot cheaper. I don't think the prices are that bad considering if you got a Miata, you would have to spend $2k on a hard top, the FRS/BRZ actually does drive nice stock compared to a Miata which has horrible stock suspension, and also all FRS/BRZ come with a LSD and many Miata do not. I also find the FRS stock seats to be pretty comfortable unlike the Miata which for my back were not tolerable. If you have't test driven one you should because they drive nice and that will give you a better idea if you want one instead of just looking at the numbers. If its primarily a track car, I agree with Paul it might make sense to buy an older NC Miata instead because you can get one cheaper, but for a primarily daily driver I think the FRS/BRZ is a good option.
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Re: BRZ or used Porsche or ??? to replace S2000 for daily/track?

Post by DanB » Fri Nov 24, 2017 8:34 am

Looks cool but I'm looking for daily-driver!
djsteviec wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 12:09 am
997 koni challenge/ grand
$39
Redding, CT
Selling this 997 koni challenge/ grand AM GS race car.
Built and raced by BGB.
Asking 39k.
Someone I race with in AER.
https://scontent.fbed1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/ ... e=5AAA0A63
https://www.facebook.com/mstach
'17 Subaru BRZ PP, #7 T60
Gone but not forgotten: Datsun 240Z, #7 SPB :cry:

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Re: BRZ or used Porsche or ??? to replace S2000 for daily/track?

Post by DanB » Fri Nov 24, 2017 9:24 am

paultg wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 3:47 pm
I think the BRZ/FRS is your best option; although when I looked at them I felt the trunk/rear seat was so usless that I might as well have a MX5 convertible.
Useless? For 2 full sized adults maybe, but you can put a lot of *stuff* back there. And you can fold down the seatbacks and fit four race wheels/tires with plenty of room left for gear. I test drove one with a 5' 6" friend in the passenger seat and 6' tall dealership guy in the back, he didn't look as cramped back there as I'd expected to be honest. I don't get it when people say that small +2 back seats are "useless". WAY more utility vs. Miata/S2000/etc. dedicated 2-seaters.
Also the 2006-2014 NC generation cars go for about 1/2 of what a BRZ/FRS costs with similar mileage (at least the older ones do).
No fixed roof, lacking utility (see above).
Only other option for you is a used 370Z, but they aren't really smaller or lighter.
Yeah, 3300+ lb. and kinda bloated looks don't do it for me...
'17 Subaru BRZ PP, #7 T60
Gone but not forgotten: Datsun 240Z, #7 SPB :cry:

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Re: BRZ or used Porsche or ??? to replace S2000 for daily/track?

Post by paultg » Fri Nov 24, 2017 11:36 am

BRZ / FRS then! I guess what frustrated me about them was the trunk wasn’t a true hatchback. If prices were equal between them and an MX5 Im not sure what I’d do.

For reference my 2010 MX5 with 68k miles, 5-speed with convince package was under $12k.
This was almost 2 years ago, so at the time a used BRZ/FRS was still a lot newer and higher cost.

If the BRZ/FRS can be had now for $15-$17k used with decent mileage it’s a hard to deal beat. I haven’t really followed them recently. If I were looking I’d get the Subaru model with HID lamps and the nicer interior cloth, proximity key.
I forgot if it’s the “limited” or “premium” version. I don’t think you can get that stuff on th FRS.
Paul G.
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Re: BRZ or used Porsche or ??? to replace S2000 for daily/track?

Post by DanB » Fri Nov 24, 2017 11:48 am

paultg wrote:
Fri Nov 24, 2017 11:36 am
BRZ / FRS then!
Looking that way!
If the BRZ/FRS can be had now for $15-$17k used with decent mileage it’s a hard to deal beat. I haven’t really followed them recently. If I were looking I’d get the Subaru model with HID lamps and the nicer interior cloth, proximity key.
I forgot if it’s the “limited” or “premium” version. I don’t think you can get that stuff on th FRS.
Limited has leather/alcantara seats, that's what I'd be getting. Used '15+ (which had some engine upgrades) are all asking over $20k. Meanwhile local Subaru dealer has four '17 BRZ Limited 6-speeds that I would bet they are willing to deal on...

I think I'm gonna skip pre-'09 Porsches because of potentially devastating issues. If I can find an '09+ Cayman for reasonable $$$ I might still go that route.
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Gone but not forgotten: Datsun 240Z, #7 SPB :cry:

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Re: BRZ or used Porsche or ??? to replace S2000 for daily/track?

Post by eb721 » Fri Nov 24, 2017 12:24 pm

BRZ is nicer, but FRS can be found a lot cheaper.
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Re: BRZ or used Porsche or ??? to replace S2000 for daily/track?

Post by Dtangard » Sat Nov 25, 2017 11:32 am

I'd go with a clean base model 987.2. You can find them for reasonable money and they are more reliable and ready for track duty than the 987.1 cars.
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